LCD Displays

Hello All

I thought I’d start a general topic about LCD displays because we are not having such good luck with ours!

What LCD displays are people using? What are the best for color consistency and evenness accross the screen? Any tricks for calibrating/profiling? What are people’s experiences with different LCD monitors in a color critical environment?

We have several 23" Apple Cinema Displays here and my color guys all complain about color shifting across the screen, bands of color and inconsistant brightness, etc., etc. Any similar experiences?

Thanks in advance!

I have just spent close to $1000 on calibrators for my 17" Gateway 610XL LCD monitor. I returned the Spyder Pro because it was worthless on MY monitor. I got a Monaco Optix Pro and it is just as bad. I have NO experience in color management or calibration. I was having color management problems with my Epson 2200 and every question I asked the 1st response was don’t talk to me UNTIL you calibrate your monitor!! When I did and they analyzed all my resulatant profiles now no one can help!!! Only 1 gentleman took the time to give me a hand and he was forthright in telling me that LCD’s are not his thing.
My advice --DON’T GET AN LCD-- for your desktop if you plan to do image editing, color printing or color management of images. It is a waste of your money and time. Not 1 so called color management manufacturer or expert can fix my problems using the same monitor I have and with my LCD it is a permanent part of the computer-can’t replace! :frowning: :smiling_imp:

The Optix XR package is right up there with the best systems. I’ve been using LCDs (and CRTs) for softproofing for some time and it can be done succesfully. My advice would be not just “Dont get an LCD”, but rather, don’t get just any LCD, or CRT for that matter, if you’re planning on doing color critical work. There aren’t that many LCDs I would outright trust for color critical work. The Eizo CG series and to a slightly lesser degree the Apple Cinema display are two that I have experience with and trust. I would be wary of most LCD displays.

Dan, maybe you could post what sort of problems you’re having, the settings you’re using, ect. Someone might be able to help, or a least determine that it is indeed a lost cuase with your monitor

I will Michael…How to get all my saved profiles into the forum is the problem.

I have a Dell 2005FPW Rev A02, Build date: June 2005 & I’ve had great results with my EyeOne Photo. Previously I had an IBM P275 (with the Trinitron 520 tube) & I find the colours, gradations & greys much more accurate & neutral. Granted, my P275 was getting on 3-4 years old, hence the need for the new screen.

I have no trouble whatsoever with colour shift or inconsistant brightness, as long as I’m directly in front of/perpendicular to the screen. Same goes for the colour banding. My soft-proof in PS CS or CS2 is quite similar to the output from my (just bought last week) R1800.

I know the ACD 20" and 2005FPW use the same LGPhilips LCD panel but apparently the Dell has far better electronics. And for the price, I doubt there are any better LCD’s ATM.
Let me tell you though, I’m a newbie at all this, :blush: & I guess I wouldn’t be using that screen if I were doing absolutely colour critical work :confused:

The cheapest LCD monitor I would trust for color work is the NEC MultiSync 2080UX+. The viewing angle is excellent, with minimal color shifts and banding. The profile I’ve generated with Eye-One Match are remarkably smooth when compared to other LCD monitors, and the gamut is decent enough (much better than the profile from NEC’s website).

The widescreen LCDs I’ve tested so far (Apple 20" DVI, Dell 2005FPW, Dell 2405FPW, HP f2105) suffer from uneven backlighting. The left side renders the image 1/3 stop lighter than the center or right side, which makes matching the color balance between images much more time consuming.

Considering that LaCie is no longer selling CRTs from their website, we could be in for a interesting ride.

As a side note, I was unable to obtain a good profile for the LaCie 19" Electron Blue IV with the Monaco Optix XR Pro.

I’m using an Apple 23" display calibrated with OPTIX XR and, I have to agree. The screen is uneven, not only in brightness, but in hue. there does seem to be a “sweet spot”, however. About 2/3 of the screen seems pretty even, with the left side being the culprit, along with the entire border. This is the second one I’m using, with the first one being worse than this.

It’s usable, it’s probably the future, but it’s not necessarily better, at least not yet, anyway.

I’m currently waiting for my second Dell 2005FPW because the first suffered from bad light leaks on the corners, so yes, there seems to be a problem with uneven backlighting, hopefully not with all their monitors, I’m hoping the next one will be good. When the screen is dark, there were obvious light streaks on teh monitor, not good for color critical work.

That is consistant with what I have seen. All the 23’s I have seen has this problem. I know several people who have the Apple 30" and report that it is much better. Most do not complain at all. I am using a LaCie 321 and find it very acceptable also.
The Eizo line is amazing, but sadly so is the price.
There are quit a few good LCD’s out there.

I have used the Monaco Optix XR to profile a number of LCD displays with out a problem, maybe your unit is defective.

Until now, LCD technology cannot show accurate color. Between the pixel of LCD cannot produce accurate color especially on dutone texture such as wood or stone texture. Therefore, it is not recommend to use LCD monitor to do color management. I think we need wait for LCD technology become mature. In the meantime, it is complaint that existing color management manufacturers do not perfrom well in this areas. if you use these software to calibrate CRT monitor, you will get better results. Therefore, the main problem is your LCD monitor not software.

I have used the apple cinema HD 23" with not problems except that screens will sorta of “burn in” if left on too long. The eizo is the way to go if you can swing the budget. Both optix xr and gretag eye one are good systems, although i believe the optix is a bit more accurate. For lcd calibration it is nice to be able to adjust rgb levels. The eizo allows this, apple doesnt or at least i have not figured out how.

With a CRT, which is an analogue device, you have a lot of latitude to set the basic calibration using the monitors own controls. The profile then has a lot less work to do to correct the characteristics when it loads the profile to the graphics cards look-up table (which is digital).
Unfortunately monitor manufacturers are producing LCD monitors for the mass market, where they think price matters more than the ability to produce calibrated colour. Even now many LCD monitors are basically 18bit (6bit per colour channel) and extend this to 16.2M colours using dithering techniques. In comparison CRTs being analogue have no ‘bit limit’ and the ‘no of colours’ limit is set by the graphics card, usually to 24bit or 16.7M.
Because of the above and because many LCD monitors have only limited user controls, LCD monitors require any calibration profile to make large corrections in the look-up table, which often leads to visible quantisation artifacts in the image.
The required profile correction can be minimised by choosing to calibrate to a ‘native’ white point, rather than a colour temperature of 5000 or 6500K.
The native whitepoint is determined by the spectral content of the LCD backlight. Normal these cold cathode backlights at least approximate 6500K. Most calibrator software has an option for native settings. Also the Spyder calibrators require you to use an extra clip-on filter for LCD work and some (older) calibrators cannot be used for LCDs.
So if you haven’t been calibrating for a ‘native’ whitepoint, try that. Alternatively get a decent CRT for your image editing work.